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Deadliest Warrior The Aftermath - Yakuza vs. Mafia

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  • Warrior_watcher's Profile
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    1. Warrior_watcher Posted on May 8 '09 at 7:40 PM

    Thanks for doing the aftermath. I really enjoy seeing our questions about the show cleared up.

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  • Deadwar69's Profile
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    2. Deadwar69 Posted on May 8 '09 at 8:36 PM

    i thought the Japanese had a gun like the sten it was called the type 100



    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_100_submachine_gun

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  • Gathercole's Profile
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    3. Gathercole Posted on May 8 '09 at 8:56 PM

    I also love the Aftermath. What other show immediately responds to fans' questions with another production? I think that's why the comments are shooting up above 300 now, and probably will go even higher next week when the M4 goes up against the AK, an argument that's started so many internet flame wars that it should probably be considered a "special weapon" in its own right!



    I think Max made a good point about the specific time periods the Mafia and Yakuza were taken from. Namely, the two gangs at those times weren't as equal as it might have appeared. The 1920s Mafia were in their golden age, operating in a country that was literally in its own Gilded age. They were lavishly funded by Prohibition, as you can see from their use of the Thompson, one of the most expensive firearms of that time period. The Thompson was literally a HUNDRED times more expensive than the Sten MkIII, which supposedly could be manufactured for the cost of a postage stamp. Comparing the two weapons is like comparing a Cessna with a Corolla.



    The 1940s Yakuza, by contrast, were operating in a country that had just been devastated and bankrupted by war. They didn't have a "golden goose" like the Mafia did during Prohibition, so they didn't have as many resources to work with.



    The differences made for an interesting comparison. For me that's the most interesting aspect of the show; warriors don't come from a vacuum; their weapons and tactics reflect their societies and cultures. At the same time; they also reflect their cultures' idea of ultimate practicality. . . after all, no one wants to pay for his vanity with his life.

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  • mosinmatt's Profile
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    4. mosinmatt Posted on May 8 '09 at 9:18 PM

    great answers!

    Like I have said. a 1940s Yakuza was probably not a HIGHLY trained martial artist. He was probably a WWII conscript that had a little training and that is it.

    The Sten was EXTREMELY easy to make. If I had the machines even I could make one.

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  • zkazama
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    5. zkazama Posted on May 8 '09 at 9:38 PM

    Max, can you explain how the bat killed more people than the pistol or how the ice pick killed about two and a half times more than the sai? I'm not trying to defend my side, it just doesn't seem to make sense and I'd like to know what I'm missing, considering that skill is taken into account. I do agree with the results from the machine guns - no amount of martial arts does sh*t against a hail of bullets.

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  • TheDeutsch77's Profile
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    6. TheDeutsch77 Posted on May 8 '09 at 10:19 PM

    My friend wnt stop talking about this.
    In the Mock up battle at the end, he has two things that annoy him, which he brings up to annoy me.

    1. He says the Mafia Leader at the end has a switchblade.
    2. He also says that, at one point, the Mafia guy has two knives.

    Can anyone weigh in on this?

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  • jdiep's Profile
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    7. jdiep Posted on May 8 '09 at 10:27 PM

    how come i cant view this video?

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  • Kokuryu169's Profile
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    8. Kokuryu169 Posted on May 8 '09 at 10:30 PM

    zkazama, good luck trying to get a response here.

    As far as I can tell once they put up the aftermath the discussion is over for them and they are already into the next thing.
    Although I will say that the Thompson decided the fight, I'm still upset over the other weapons.
    Please Max, I'd also like to know how a bat and an ICE PICK outdid the pistol and sai, it would mean looking over the data that was entered into the program.

    1000 simulations with bad data = 1000 piles of crap

    If there were any errors then they would have to Justify that. But they just assume that what they did was right the first time to heck with what anyone else says.

    The easiest solution is to have someone in a Quality Control position to oversee what they do, but they don't have the money to spend on something that would make their program better.

    They are just being paid to put out a product, regardless of its quality.

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  • Bogus41
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    9. Bogus41 Posted on May 8 '09 at 10:56 PM

    This is great. Thanks for this guys. This kicks ass.

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  • Nived86's Profile
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    10. Nived86 Posted on May 8 '09 at 11:38 PM

    the red Mafia would kick the sh#t out the Mafia

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  • Kokuryu169's Profile
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    11. Kokuryu169 Posted on May 8 '09 at 11:39 PM

    Gathercole,

    to be honest I think the reason why the comments keep shooting up higher and higher is because the show is not addressing its problems and if anything its getting worse each week.

    They have yet to address why they refuse to do the same test twice to compare weapons.

    Even in this Aftermath, Max said that even though swords were an option, they decided to not use them in order to showcase different weapons.

    That right there is a blatant admission that they are not choosing the most Effective weapons that the warriors had access to, but are picking the weapons They Want to show.

    This means that they are not interested in showing a true Objective representation of the warrior in question. They just want to put on a show that goes the way they want it to.

    This is Why the Gladiator had a sling and not a bow.

    This is Why the Viking was also denied a bow.

    This is Why the Samurai was given a Naginata instead of a chain mail puncturing Yari.
    Or the Kanabo was chosen when Samurai had access to Arquebuses.

    The fact that Max has yet to explain certain results from the programming means that he either doesn't know, or that explaining them would mean admitting that he 'tweaked' the data for an intended result.

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  • KSUWildcat2688's Profile
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    12. KSUWildcat2688 Posted on May 9 '09 at 12:13 AM

    I agree with everyone who has said that the Yakuza were in fact cheated in this episode. I have posted comments on this and all I can say is that for once there was an unfair advantage given to someone and it was the Mafia. The Yakuza surely had the advantage but they were shot down when the Katana was ousted. And to answer the question regarding the Bat vs. The Sai...HEY MAX GUESS WHAT ANY THUG WORTH HIS SALT CAN WIELD A BAT BUT IT TAKES A TRUE WARRIOR OF DISCIPLINE, HONOR AND RESPECT TO WIELD A PAIR OF JAPANESE SAI'S!!!!! The sai's are one f the most difficult weapons in the Japanese arsenal to learn and master and as Zero-san showed if you are fluid with them just as if it were the Nunchaku and Katana then you are better off on the giving end than the receiving end because the Nunchaku can deal great damage and trauma than a bat plus a pair of sai's and Nunchaku can disarm anyone including a bat wielding thug!!!

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  • nateoak10's Profile
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    13. nateoak10 Posted on May 9 '09 at 12:16 AM

    best week of this show yet hands down. everyweek should switch offf. modern anciant modern etc etc

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  • biggidy's Profile
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    14. biggidy Posted on May 9 '09 at 12:36 AM

    yo- we wanna see a zulu warrior vs. 1 of gengas khans guys. my $$ is on the zulu

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  • flying_tomahawk's Profile
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    15. flying_tomahawk Posted on May 9 '09 at 5:25 AM

    The video won't play!!!

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  • filipabsconditus's Profile
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    16. filipabsconditus Posted on May 9 '09 at 5:55 AM

    Guys, the thing we need to remember is that this show is for entertainment purposes. I totally agree with everyone's concerns, but when it comes down to it, DW is going to cater to the uneducated masses who would rather see explosions and baseballs bats breaking heads than real comparisons.



    BTW: zkazama- you with bare hands vs the mafia weapons guy with a baseball bat, I'd bet a paycheck on you.

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  • Bill_Rubin's Profile
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    17. Bill_Rubin Posted on May 9 '09 at 7:22 AM

    Did Max Geiger explain why the ice pick was deadlier than the pistol? I can't get the video to play. Thanks.



    ice pick: 24 kills

    walter P38: 10 kills



    I would really like to know, because this puts the accuracy of the computer program, and the show, into question.

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  • pug826's Profile
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    18. pug826 Posted on May 9 '09 at 12:13 PM

    awesome job on this. i agree the mafia deserved the win.

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  • tony6996's Profile
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    19. tony6996 Posted on May 9 '09 at 12:17 PM

    All you people who are complaining about the katana just need to calm down and think for 2 seconds.



    1. Just watch the video, the guy explains!!

    2. A katana takes 8 months (i think) to make, so i'm guessing it costs a lot. Do you really thing the average yakuza soldier would own a katana, let alone take it to a fight like that.

    3. Just look at the kills, the only real factor was the submachine guns.

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  • mk028's Profile
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    20. mk028 Posted on May 9 '09 at 12:18 PM

    Hey Max and Kieren (spelled wrong),

    I cant thank you guys enough for doing the aftermath show and answering our questions. You guys are doing an awesome job on one of the best shows on TV. Thank you sirs.

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  • mk028's Profile
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    21. mk028 Posted on May 9 '09 at 12:39 PM

    I would also like to really thank max for taking the time to personally respond to peoples questions here with his posts. Its deffinately noticed and appreciated.

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  • mosinmatt's Profile
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    22. mosinmatt Posted on May 9 '09 at 1:34 PM

    Dear god people watch the video. A katana is not something you would lug around on the streets of tokyo.

    If they did have a katana, it would probably not be those historical professionally smithed ones. It would probably be a mass produced stamped WWII one.

    Like I said before, They would probably also prefer a smaller blade that can be easily hidden.

    Nunchucku are also not as effective as a baseball bat. With a bat, you can get a more direct forceful blow. It is also more versatile and can be used to thrust, and block as well.

    I own a p1 (same as the p38). Now it is a good gun. But a 9mm is not likely to kill you right away. It is accurate, but not that fast.

    Again with the martial arts. While he may get some training while in the Yakuza, if he is fresh he probably wont have any, outside some quick WWII conscript training. Remember, just cause someone is Japanse, doesnt mean they know Karate

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  • DarthRevan
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    23. DarthRevan Posted on May 9 '09 at 1:55 PM

    I dunno...I understand the katana is a cherished eapon and all, and that they wanted to test new stuff...but it seems that because of that, the deck was stacked against the Yakuza. Simply because the Mafia had much better firearms. The least that they could do is give them a much larger advantage with the katana. Still, I love the aftermath, love the show, and lookin forward to the next episode!

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  • dannyrox32's Profile
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    24. dannyrox32 Posted on May 9 '09 at 2:45 PM

    I have a question. Doesnt most of the battle depend on the setting or obsticles?

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  • DW_BeAsT's Profile
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    25. DW_BeAsT Posted on May 9 '09 at 4:12 PM

    i also think that the the sai had a much greater advantage to any old ice pick and the yakuza could have wielded the katana sword but concidering the cost of one of those things and not being able to hide it being a criminal I dont think that a yakuza would want to buy one of those after 1940's Japan was just bankrupted by a war & an m38 pistol isnt very good compared to a tommy gun.

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  • lilasianboy's Profile
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    26. lilasianboy Posted on May 9 '09 at 5:43 PM

    y CANT I WATCH THIS VIDEO AND THE OTHER ONES?!?!

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  • Flying_Dragon
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    27. Flying_Dragon Posted on May 9 '09 at 8:23 PM

    It seems to me that the Mafia spent a heck of a lot of time whacking and robbing each other, that's their code of honor. I still think that in general, an ex-soldier who had a greater chance of being battle trained and quite a few of the Yakuza, who may not have taken part in the war, due to being anti government and therefore trained in martial arts, still would have been a force to reckon with in hand to hand combat.
    For those of you who asked about the Type 100, they were used in japan at that time, but only about 30,000 were made and to this day, not many left. In contrast, more than 2 million Stens were built during WW2 and a lot more readily available. The British Sten and the Type 100 were very similar and the Yakuza would have had an easier time getting the the Sten than the Type 100.
    I still can't believe that a gumba with a bat could beat a Sai welding Yakuza. Let the two weapons experts demonstrate their skills.

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  • THirstyLizard
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    28. THirstyLizard Posted on May 9 '09 at 9:40 PM

    Great job guys. You answered a lot of questions. For those who keep asking " Why didn't you answer this question or that?", think, they have A LOT of comments and questions to go over. They have to pick and choose. If they tried to explain all the questions asked they would have no time for the show. Also this should explain one question that I saw. : Why are the experts badmouthing the other team?, Its just for the tests." Would a show that has 2 different teams not be supportive of their team and want them to win? Look at the ninja vs. spartan battle. Even when there was proof that the ninja's kasarigama wouldn't get into the armor he still tried to convince the experts that his side would still win.

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  • Ing's Profile
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    29. Ing Posted on May 10 '09 at 3:18 AM

    All this talk of martial arts makes me wonder. It seems obvious to me that despite the delusions many people seem to cherish, unarmed martial arts skills are no substitute for having a deadly weapon at your disposal. But lots of people keep saying the martial arts of the ninja and yakuza got left out and should have made a difference.



    Maybe the Aftermath guys can answer this:



    Do the simulations provide for martial arts techniques like striking, throws, wrestling holds, etc., and if so, how much of a difference have they made in the final outcome?

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  • Lucknorris's Profile
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    30. Lucknorris Posted on May 10 '09 at 5:40 AM

    SOMEONE HELP!

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  • Lucknorris's Profile
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    31. Lucknorris Posted on May 10 '09 at 5:41 AM

    spike vids never work for me. how can I make them work?

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  • flying_tomahawk's Profile
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    32. flying_tomahawk Posted on May 10 '09 at 6:06 AM

    Finally got the video to play tonight, thanks for answering my comment guys. Looking forward to next week's episode!

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  • PraetorianMDS's Profile
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    33. PraetorianMDS Posted on May 10 '09 at 9:06 AM

    Why are you people still bitching about the katana not being used? They just explained that the katana was never used by the Yakuza in combat.



    Also, David Kono is not telling the truth. The Yakuza are not trained martial arts "masters". Maybe they were hundreds of years ago, but certainly not in modern times.

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  • Carosion's Profile
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    34. Carosion Posted on May 10 '09 at 11:54 AM

    u never mention about the nun chucks' disarming capability.

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  • Achilles9's Profile
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    35. Achilles9 Posted on May 10 '09 at 12:25 PM

    The Green Berets I think will win the fight, although i predict it will be an extremely close and almost equal match I see Green Berets commnig out on top without a doubt.

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  • jeffersoncream's Profile
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    36. jeffersoncream Posted on May 10 '09 at 2:36 PM

    you guys should make one episode with a cowboy vs. something else

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  • Nived86's Profile
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    37. Nived86 Posted on May 10 '09 at 5:58 PM

    cowboys don't exist except in movies and TV it have to be a lawman or a gunslinger. since there not being realistic i say they base the Green Berets on Rambo.

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  • marceleo's Profile
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    38. marceleo Posted on May 10 '09 at 9:20 PM

    if i do finsih the episode and the mafia wins...this show is comlpetly a bust. I didnt even know there was a japense type mafia until now, so u know im not bias. and second , they purposly chose a pair of numbchucks over a sword. because they know the sword would have changed the fight big time. Just like how they took away stealth from the ninja against spartan because the spartans defense and etc, were jacked up.

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  • firecat1099's Profile
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    39. firecat1099 Posted on May 10 '09 at 9:54 PM

    this was a good match up, but why pick the yakuza and not a more well known opponent for the mofia. it semed like a wierd match up. Yakuza are from the 40s and mofia is from the 20s that seemed a little weird. that just proves how awsome the mofia was. immagine if the mofia lasted until the same time as the yakusa. that would be total domination by the mofia.

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  • LorenzoX's Profile
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    40. LorenzoX Posted on May 10 '09 at 10:01 PM

    Nothing Against any of the people in the show, but you guys would make good politicians! almost every aftermath that you did there were a lot of questions that you talked about but really didn't answer. like if someone asks the amount of penetration after the armor and chain mail you just said chain mail isn't good for stopping bullets or flesh is easy for a bullet compared to plate mail. none of that tells us how much it penetrated. why all the beating around the bush? seems kind of deceptive too me.

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  • womackmathew
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    41. womackmathew Posted on May 10 '09 at 10:12 PM

    you should have known plain an simply that the mafia was gonna win, the mafia is more vicous with their attacks they dont take time to simply look flashy they get in do their job and get out they are seriously the better warrior and the deadliest, and no one can compare

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  • firecat1099's Profile
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    42. firecat1099 Posted on May 10 '09 at 10:13 PM

    cant what to see the next aftermath. looking forward to seeing the kick-ass automatic weapons in the next episode.

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  • Wiegs's Profile
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    43. Wiegs Posted on May 10 '09 at 10:17 PM

    I am about tired of all this Army crap! I have noticed that the next episode is Green Beret vs. Spetsnaz; I have to say that Spetsnaz are going to kick ass. Now put the U.S. Marines in the picture and they will win. Army always has to be saved by the Marines, Marines kicked ass Montezuma, Tripoli, Guadal Canal, Tarawa, Iwo Jima, Okinawa, Hue City, Falujah, Bahgdad. Marines are always there first Army cleans up the bodies that Marines leave behind. Marines get one call from the President and they go, Army has to wait for mommy congress.

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  • joncwilson's Profile
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    44. joncwilson Posted on May 10 '09 at 10:18 PM

    I had high hopes for this show, but after watching a few episodes, those hopes are now fleeting. The complete lack of research of histories, techniques, and styles would lead one to believe that this show is nothing more than mindless entertainment.

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  • courtellis
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    45. courtellis Posted on May 10 '09 at 10:21 PM

    I think just by shooting up the place, it could have been a tie with everyone just outright killing each other. This is a fun show, although it doesn't show case a lot of things. Both organizations have their methods and codes of honor, and both can make you go to sleep. The Mafia always has cool music on tv lol.

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  • bizzkit612's Profile
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    46. bizzkit612 Posted on May 10 '09 at 10:46 PM

    im not a history buff but i do know a bit about fighing. the Yakuza were highly trained in fighting and they would absoluty win in a fight with siys or numchucks aginst a baceball bat or what was that a ice pick. they seem to only take into consideration the brute fore over skill. a Master with a rock can beat a novis with a gun

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  • Desert-Mole's Profile
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    47. Desert-Mole Posted on May 10 '09 at 10:47 PM

    How can you compare the Walther to sawn off shotgun? Why not compare a tractor and a geo metro? I dont think you will need a fancy computer simulator to see which can pull a heavier load.

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  • Ninjaface_shuriken's Profile
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    48. Ninjaface_shuriken Posted on May 10 '09 at 10:58 PM

    k, theres so many holes in this show its rediculous. first off, what about the environment? Im sure if it was night in the wilderness, a ninja could kill a spartan in 5 seconds flat. Secondly, what about range? if the yakuza's weapons generally had better range and accuracy, it might be possible for them to win in an outdoor situation, unlike what they showed. and for the knight, and maybe the samurai, u cant just say oh there they are, they ride horses, and the horse would carry the weight of the armour, give power and momentum, etc.

    and why do they need a computer program to verify shit? cant these people make their own conclusions based on the information gathered rather than input a bunch of numbers that would differ in real life into some sort of rpg-style simulator? its not that hard, jeez people

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  • ickbar
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    49. ickbar Posted on May 10 '09 at 11:02 PM

    zkzama, flying-dragon, seriously just STOP trash talking. It's one thing to put up a fight when there's a legitimate grievance you can back with evidence and statistics but you guys make the rest of us look and sound like retards especially when talking about how a Mk.3 Sten had laser like accuracy? Are you fricken kidding me? it's a cheap stamped metal POS with a 2 inch barrel utilizing an open bolt, making it literally the most inaccurate Submachine gun that's ever been made on this planet.

    That being said If the damn Yakuza can get their hands on a Walther P38 which is much more harder to manufacture and is made by a european country thousands of miles on the other side of the planet. You might as well include the MG42, MP40, M1A1 Thompson .45 ACP, Colt1911A1 .45 ACP, Sterling SMG, Browing automatic rifle, FG42 etc.. etc...

    Weapons that are not available to scumbags from the 1920's which again makes the debate over weapons between two groups of scumbags that are 20 years apart in technology in the 20th century absolutely retarded.

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  • Knucklehead1256's Profile
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    50. Knucklehead1256 Posted on May 10 '09 at 11:08 PM

    I think the sai is a far better weapon then the ice pick because of it's very vercitile and it it can poke you alot deeper. And i think the knunchucks should've won because they allow you to move more freely and can be used to string together multiple attacks in rapid session versus the bat being slow and telegraphed weapon. this was a good fight tho i would like to see a shaolin monk vs The Kshatriyans

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Posted: May 08, 2009
Description: This week's Aftermath delves deeper into a bloody turf war between two of... (more)
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