Green Beret vs. Spetsnaz

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  1. dragon9484 Posted on May 12 '09 at 11:06 PM

  I have one question what about body armour. Why was it not tested?

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  2. Sashko81 Posted on May 12 '09 at 11:20 PM

  you rely on body armor - you die... you rely on movement - you live...

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  3. AsoYaToe Posted on May 12 '09 at 11:36 PM

  wouldn't the Dragunov Sniper rifle beat the M24 in this type of modern combat? I mean, one shot is all it take to drop a man with either but the Dragunov would be able to put more rounds downrange to take out a squad before he would have to reload when the M24 has to pull a bolt for every shot it takes.

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  4. Baadooby Posted on May 13 '09 at 12:19 AM

  I dunno where to post this but considering how close the fight was with the weapons they brought. . . . Why in the WORLD didn't the Green Beret bring the "SPAS 12". . . . Semi Vs. Pump. . .? Yeah of COURSE we got outclassed. SPAS would have owned that Saiga POS with additional 5 rounds. . . NOT to mention why aren't the tests the same ? ? Nade, Shotgun, CQC where totally different. I don't know where they learned how to do tests but usually they are under identical circumstances. . . SPIKE I love you for AWESOME shows but please FIX THIS. I think I speak for MANY others when I say I would have LOVED to seen how well the balistic knife went into a gel dummy (Perhaps the skull).

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  5. deserteagledemon Posted on May 13 '09 at 12:22 AM

  I think this is a great episode nothing like the 2 greatest superpowers elite military verses one another, but i don't like a couple things about the spetsnaz. 1. is the combat rolling the time it takes u to roll u could be riddled with bullets i find it a waist of movement especially in close quarters. 2. is the spetsnaz combat knife i find it ridiculous to have a knife witch shoots out the blade, its meant as a close hand weapon of last resort if u miss with that blade ur disarmed and at a disadvantage. The bad thing i see about our green berets is the Mossberg its slow compared to other semi-auto shotguns that are out there, the spetsnaz can put more rounds into more targets in less time. now if they went to the new AA-12 shotgun then they would have one more multi purpose weapon to there arsenal.

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  6. ripsytipsy Posted on May 13 '09 at 12:37 AM

  This is the first episode that I think the outcome is spot on. I'm American and was rooting for my boys but those damn Russians seemed on another level. Good decision.

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  7. brocknrollin Posted on May 13 '09 at 12:41 AM

  test

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  8. geo8x6 Posted on May 13 '09 at 1:00 AM

  I served with the U.S. Army back during the cold war (1980-1987) and fired a number of both the Soviet and U.S. weapons. I know that the Makarov pistol from that era had a very under powered 9x18mm cartridge and wouldn't stand up to either the M1911 pistol from the late 80's nor the M9 pistol now in use. Stopping power of each individual weapon should have been tested as it was back in that time frame. Also, why wasn't the Ballistic Knife fired into a gel torso to show the penetration? Sure a neck shot would be devastating, but would it penetrate a flack vest or even say web gear? Incomplete results leave too much to speculation.

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  9. brocknrollin Posted on May 13 '09 at 1:02 AM

  First, I want to say I've watched the whole season thus far, love the idea of the show, but sometimes get frustrated when obvious elements of the battles get left out. With this particular show, it really frustrated me that body armor was not accounted for. Body armor would have drastically changed the outcome as the data from certain tests would have been drastically different (Ballistic Knife, The Russian pistol shots to the shoulder). The knife should have been tested multiple times, at a moving or slightly moving target to show how often it can be fatally accurate.
  
  Mobility and agility of the warriors while FULLY ARMORED should definitely be taken into account! The weight and size of the weapons would surely be detrimental to how someone can move and be effective in the battlefield, so wouldn't another statistic to add into the program be how agile and fatally effective the fighters are? The coolest addition you could bring to the show would be right before the final simulation: the warriors have to complete an obstacle course where they utilize all the weapons they brought, and have to use each one for a kill or series of kills (i.e. use the machine gun to clear a room of hostiles, then use your pistol advancing down a hallway, enter a room and use your knife on a ballistic body, etc). The exercise would be identical for both warriors. The timing, along with the effective fatality rate of the exercise for each warrior could really tip the balances on the warriors, as well as give the audience a complete realistic look of the warriors using their whole arsenal in an extended exercise (versus just having the cheesy simulation, WHICH WE LOVE AND WOULD STILL GET, but also get to see this exercise test agility, mobility, and ability to fatally execute in multiple successions.

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  10. brocknrollin Posted on May 13 '09 at 1:02 AM

  ...And hire me for the show to contribute ideas!

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  11. cvwtd71 Posted on May 13 '09 at 1:09 AM

  7v/4? i figured 8v8. why they do it like that.

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  12. Izzuken Posted on May 13 '09 at 1:22 AM

  hi ppl. The show doesnt play, wtf? the length is 2 seconds

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  13. E_the_almighty Posted on May 13 '09 at 1:25 AM

  the only thing I thought was weird was, did the last spetsnaz guy in the video have Two ballistics knives? cause the green beret guy knocked it out of his hand with the shovel, then a second later he has another one in his hand and shoots it at him.
  
  Also, like someone else said, why didn't they test each side's body armor (like putting it on the test dummies)???
  
  I remember in the episode with the spartan vs ninja, they said the biggest deciding factor in that was his shield. so why not here?
  
  Now I don't know exactly what type of armor both the spetsnaz and the green beret use, but from the guys (actors) in the videos throughout the episode, it looked like the green beret had much better armor. I think it would've been interesting to see how many less "kill shots" there were with testing each sides Body armor.

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  14. oversteer Posted on May 13 '09 at 1:38 AM

  I think there needs to be several things noted on this episode. 1. Green berets and the Spetsnaz are not on the same level. Spetsnaz were the Russian creme de la creme of their special operations while in the US army, 1st SFOD-D (aka Delta) are the most elite, not Green Berets. 2. With that noted, most of the weapons that the Green Berets used in the episode were weapons that majority of regular army infantry uses. Delta, Seals and other operators can use the higher caliber .45 HK Mark 23 pistol, many different rifles and automatic shotguns. Furthermore, I don't know ANY green hat that carries an e-tool on their kit. That's ridiculous. 3. Lastly, one of the green berets in the show was only a Staff Sergeant. A Green beret fresh out of the Q-course graduates as a Sergeant and can be promoted as fast as 6 months after graduation to Staff Sergeant. Why wasn't someone with more experience and more deployments chosen such as a Master Sergeant or at least Sergeant First Class?
  
  Spetsnaz > Green Beret
  SFOD-D > Spetsnaz

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  15. M240MachineGunner Posted on May 13 '09 at 1:45 AM

  So many great American U.S. Army foot soldier / special forces weapons were not even used for this contest. The M9 Bayonet, The M203 Grenade Launcher, The M49 "Thumper" Grenade Launcher, The M18A1 Claymore Mine, The M249 SAW Light Machine Gun, The M240-B Medium Machine Gun or The M60 Medium Machine Gun, The M2A1 "MA DUCE" 50 Cal Heavy Machine Gun, MK19 Machine Gun Grenade Launcher, The M82A1 Barret 50 Cal. Sniper Rifle, The M29A1 or M252 81-mm Medium Mortar, The M72 LAW Rocket Launcher, The AT4 Rocket Launcher, The M47 Dragon Anti-Tank Missile, FGM-148 Javolin Anti-Armor Missile, FIM-92 Stinger Surface to Air Missle (SAM). Not to mention the Singar Radio and TACSAT and GPS for calling in pin point artillery strikes, naval bombardments, air strikes, specter gunships, helicopter gunships, etc. Also no covereage on they're hand to hand combat skills, knife fighting skills or improvised weapons skills. The night vision portion was also bogus because the NVG's they showed are not military grade. They should have used PVS-14's (GEN III) or PVS-7's (GEN II), Aimpoint's, Aicog's, spoting scopes or laser range finders or how about some thermal imaging. One other thing not covered is American Body Armor, lets see some Interceptor and DragonSkin Body Armor with SAPI Plates and the K-pot or PASAGT Helmet's or how about taking American battle field medicine like quick clot into consideration. You can't really compare the Green Berets and the Spetznas with out doing a in depth comparison of both sides and this show didn't even scratch the surface.

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  16. Wrath_of_Anon Posted on May 13 '09 at 1:56 AM

  I really enjoyed the Episode. One question for the Aftermath crew: Why did you choose to go with the GRU circa 1980 as opposed to now? The modern Spetsnaz have a few refinements to their arsenal like the VSS Vintorez rifle that could have helped increase the spread in what was a really close fought match up.
  
  Also now that I think of it, to what degree was the martial arts training of the combatants taken into account? I'm not familiar with what fighting style the Green Beret's use but I know that Russian Systema is downright scary in terms of effectively shutting down an opponent up close (Sonny's "I still have my hands" comment seems more relevant after you seen a Systema user punch someone in the spleen faster than they blink)

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  17. dspva Posted on May 13 '09 at 2:26 AM

  1. The Mossberg shotgun is pump action because there isn't a semi auto military grade shotgun out there that does not have tendency to jam. The reliability of weapons should have been factored in.
  
  2. Body armor should have been tested...American Military standard issue body armor is capable of stopping any Russian rifle round....armor was tested in every other episode.
  
  3. This comparison was hardly scientific and is an insult to the our miltary men....I will never watch this show again.

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  18. laughingflamex Posted on May 13 '09 at 2:31 AM

  the video is not working for me and i want to c this can anyone help me

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  19. specialkcl66 Posted on May 13 '09 at 2:40 AM

  I also only have one question:
  
  Why was Oil of Olay advertised on this show when I just watched it online?

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  20. Moreofthesame Posted on May 13 '09 at 2:48 AM

  Brocknrollin, I have to say... That is probably the best idea I've read from any of the comments I've seen posted after each episode. Though I think it would be fun to add a couple moving targets as well, maybe get just some little quiet floor machine to wave them back and forth or something. Then have some dummies with armor and some without, its one thing to go "Hey theres a target", and another to go "Hey theres a target with armor, so I'll aim somewhere other than the torso." Guess it would be a reaction timing test, aswell as perception.
  
  
  
  Also would like to add, "HAH!" To all those people that "burried" the posters that had supported the russians on the "expert analysis" article. I thought that was really pathetic. Someone supports another country, or is saying "USA is only going to win, because its an american program" so lets give them such a bad raiting that it becomes hidden? I love my country, I had dreamed of joining the military... But I have to say, the russians had a nicer combat style. Granted the rolling was unneeded, but if you do a single roll from one door to another across the hallway... I think youd have a better chance of not getting hit, than just running. The russians just seemed to have a better fighting style with guns. Though it was pretty lame when they were almost all picked off so easily in the beginning of the simulation, was hoping for a fight more like the one in mafia vs yakuza.. minus the staring at eachother.

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  21. AmericanWarrior Posted on May 13 '09 at 2:53 AM

  What we really need is to have the US Marine VS the Royal Marine. I have been wondering for a long time who would win; the Royal Marines have 9 months of boot camp compared to US Marines 3 months, but we are alot more disciplined and our boot camp is tougher.

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  22. ninerbob2 Posted on May 13 '09 at 3:11 AM

  I have watched a couple of episodes and enjoyed them. But having watched this episode and being a retired Special forces Soldier, I can say you computer geeks are not military experts and your calculations leave out some important factors. The training, history and infrastructure of the US Army S.F. is so much more advanced and practical than Russian Spetsnaz. SF are trained to be thinking on their feet warriors and the Spetsnaz are more along the lines of being a thug. You Deadliest warrior "experts" seemed to be impressed with the fact these Spetsnaz can take a beating, well, this isn't going to matter much in a fire team on fire team shootout with advanced firearms in MOUT terrain. The Spetsnaz focus more on hand to hand and their rolling around on the ground they displayed takes practice and the truth is this training is wasted on the battle field because it isn't practical and as the Green Beret said, "I'll just raise my weapon and shoot as they roll around". Getting beat up doesn't make one a better soldier. Green Berets are trained to use their mind and think on their own and Spetsnaz aren't nearly enough so. It is easy to see the inteligence level of the Special Forces soldiers is much greater than that of the Spetsnaz. The Green Berets were professional and the Spetsnaz were smart asses and beligerent like thugs belittling the Green Berets. The info you put into your computer, I think you give to much importance to the in close hand to hand combat weapons. The truth is these weapons will not come into play probably at all during a fire fight. You run scenarios a 1,000 times, I believe maybe one or two of the 1,000 scenarios might end up in close quarters hand to hand combat in a real life situation. This is due to the automatic weapons, grenades, and advanced training being used in combat. You run the computer 1,000 times to rule out luck etc., well the pistol competition shot at night should of been shot a minimum of 3 times and perhaps 5

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  23. ninerbob2 Posted on May 13 '09 at 3:25 AM

  Part of my message was cut off, here is the rest:
  
  
  
  This is due to the automatic weapons, grenades, and advanced training being used in combat. You run the computer 1,000 times to rule out luck etc., well the pistol competition shot at night should of been shot a minimum of 3 times and perhaps 5 times to rule out luck or just having a bad run. The bottom line is, what you use as criteria and your lack of Military experience makes your "expert" analysis not so expert and the show lost alot of credibility with me. Sorry, just the facts.

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  24. Brutzman Posted on May 13 '09 at 3:28 AM

  Ok my problem with is with the shotguns that were used by the Green Berets. These days the armed forces use the SEMI-AUTO Benelli M1014. why was that not showcased in place of the Mossberg 590? also why wasn't the Pistol a Colt M-1911?

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  25. crom66 Posted on May 13 '09 at 3:35 AM

  I love this show but I don't always agree with their choices.For one I would have matched the Spetsnaz against the Navy Seals not the Green Beret,no offense to our elite special forces.Also some of the tests were different witch did not not seem fear to me and as its been repeated in previous posts body armour was not even mentioned.

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  26. specialkcl66 Posted on May 13 '09 at 3:38 AM

  Did anyone notice Sunny say that the Taliban was terrified of the Spetznaz? Remind me how that war turned out for the Soviets?

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  27. ajc518 Posted on May 13 '09 at 3:47 AM

  How come time was a factor in determining shotguns, but not assault rifles. At that distance it was obvious they would hit the targets, so why not time it. The time it took the Spetsnaz to roll on the ground would of been much longer then the SF guy.
  
  
  
  How come it showed the SF guys running around with their berrets on in combat?
  
  
  
  How come so many different tests were used to compare the weapons. Each one should of had the same test.
  
  
  
  You had one Spetsnaz guy from the Russian Navy, but no US Seal? Seals work with SF all the time.

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  28. pg797 Posted on May 13 '09 at 3:57 AM

  I sorta saw this coming...Spetsnaz is Russia's most elite special forces unit and the Green Berets are just a top-tier special forces group...i should've been the Navy SEALs since they are the best force the U.S. has to offer...it was a pretty good show though...and the Green Berets should have definitely gone with a better shotgun

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  29. 49erminer20 Posted on May 13 '09 at 4:02 AM

  To bad they didn't test the badass factor: Edge-> Green Berret

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  30. JasonRedfield Posted on May 13 '09 at 4:06 AM

  I was unhappy with a few things on this episode.
  
  First of all, the Beretta vs. Makarov test. Ask any gun expert, they'll tell you that the the Beretta is overall a better weapon. It's full-sized, with a larger magazine, more stopping power, etc. You've said in the past that you can only really test the weapons of each warrior and their effects, since the "skill" of each is really only speculation. But now you contradict yourselves by favoring the Spetsnaz's higher amount of skill in the pistol test, completely disregarding the clear advantages of the Beretta.
  
  Secondly, what happened to body armor? Why wasn't it taken into account? Which special forces group is more commonly issued body armor? Which warrior's body armor is more effective? It could have been a crucial test.
  
  Finally, why weren't tests between weapons kept consistent? The ballistic knife got an entirely different test than the E-Tool, despite the fact that they're both "Special Weapons". The test with the grenades really favored the Americans, in my opinion.

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  31. matt0929 Posted on May 13 '09 at 4:07 AM

  i think if you are going to test a grenade you should test both of them on the same type of material in my opinion they where both equal i dont think that judging a mushroom cloud is the way to go if your going to put a grenade into a washer then do it with both of them. also when you test with the ballistics gel you should test with both of them the ballistics gel makes the weapon look really deadly where as the other white body doesn't look at deadly

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  32. Eisbein Posted on May 13 '09 at 4:35 AM

  Some how the video wont play? starts for the first 2 seconds ands stops.
  anyone with the same problem?

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  33. acdcdude Posted on May 13 '09 at 4:39 AM

  they didnt even judge the soviets secret Russian martial art of systema, if they did hand to hand Russia woulda won hands down. If you havent seen systema look it up, theres an eight minute video showing the top 4 in the world, all russian

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  34. Confuzedd Posted on May 13 '09 at 4:42 AM

  These vids never load for me!!!!!

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  35. capinshane25 Posted on May 13 '09 at 4:56 AM

  I nlove this show watch it every week but why did they choose the hospital that took out the whole sniper rifle win for the greenbarets
  
  Also if our boys overseas watched this were all sorry for the loss of morale seeing your comrades getting gunned down by the russians.

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  36. specialkcl66 Posted on May 13 '09 at 5:26 AM

  somehow I think the U.S. Government has done better testing (and a lot more of it) than the "two techno geeks." I'm not really losing sleep and I doubt our boys overseas are either.
  
  Anyone who has played golden eye knows how retarded "combat rolls" are. Really what is the point of that? How does someone fight better on the ground?

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  37. Shinobi924 Posted on May 13 '09 at 5:28 AM

  There are too many things you are missing. Even though i did not like the fact that American Forces lost even at a small margin, it is still funny the fact that they most elite the top unit of Russian Forces almost couldnt handle, excuse the lack of the better terms, the lowest form of special forces. Green Berets were like the more advanced and slightly better trained than of the standard American soldier. I cannot believe that the M4a1 Carbine is tied with the AK 74 because the fact that the M4 is much more accurate and much more versatile. The Ballistic Knife could have missed or hit the arm because I'm pretty sure that Russian Soldiers weren"t known for their "accuracy". The only reason why the M9 Baretta lost to the Marakov is basically because the guy was rushing through the whole thing saying "17 seconds? well F*^k you!" This system is flawed and you can't get the most accurate analysis unless you add those things in, plus something that always had come into play for centuries of war, and that's luck. Redo all of your tests, GIVE EVERYONE THE SAME TEST! Don't give one guy a pig and then another guy multiple targets!
  
  Looking at other comments that I see, there are very good points made, but basically whats happening here is that you are missing way too many things here. It could be some other weapons and armor but like I said and I'll say it again, you are missing LUCK!

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  38. Izzuken Posted on May 13 '09 at 5:35 AM

  Does this site have technical support? i cannot watch the video, it shows that the length is only 2 seconds and stops eventually. I have watched previous episodes without any problems. Any ideas how can it be fixed?

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  39. nismodave187 Posted on May 13 '09 at 5:38 AM

  what i dont get is why they did a pistol comparison like that. night vision testing in a cqb type of test really depends more on the skill of the weapon's user. not the handgun itself. so the test wasnt about the pistol at all. oh and why didnt they emphasize on magazine capacity, 15 rounds in the beretta, and 8 in the makarov.

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  40. Abe3577 Posted on May 13 '09 at 5:38 AM

  I have enjoyed the show but this is the most ridiculous outcome thus far. I would take any fixed weapon over that ridiculous ballistics knife. The AK74 and the M4 are equal? Have these people ever heard of a thing called MOA? If you clamped an M4 to a table and fired the weapon twice without moving it a bit the two bullets would hit within a half an inch of each other. Using the same method with the AK74 you would be lucky to get a 3in grouping. The Beretta pistol is also far superior to the Tokarov. This test was faulty because the individual Beret that tested the pistol did not use his training or Beret like discipline when he blew through the course. And as for the Saiga shotgun over the Mossberg. Sure the Saiga is semi auto but for anyone who has had to unjam a jammed semi-auto shotgun (which they are very prone to doing) enough has been said

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  41. jrags Posted on May 13 '09 at 5:48 AM

  A green beret would kick the mongrel, communist spetnaz butt. The two geeks who produce the show have no clue. Maybe they should get out in the real world and see the true training of the elite green berets, not some BS they put together on a tv show.
  
  
  
  Congratulations, the deadliest warrior just lost a ton of viewers by putting down the green berets. Me and a unch of friends will never watch this again.
  
  
  
  Maybe the communist lover Obama helped produce the episode.

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  42. Andoreasu Posted on May 13 '09 at 5:54 AM

  Can someone please tell me why the episode is only 2 sec long, and why it won't play properly, its so annoying...

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  43. mjdevries Posted on May 13 '09 at 6:02 AM

  I have a couple of issues with this "simulation." First of all, I am just a regular Marine Corps Grunt and I assure you that given the same circumstances with the pistol, I would have been able to drop all of those targets. The Spetsnaz guy simply walked up to each target and put his muzzle into the chest of the target... Betcha I can hit him before that, even without night vision capabilities. Also, why would the Green Berets choose an E-Tool for a special weapon. Don't get me wrong, I know several people with confirmed E-Tool kills but it is not a special weapon. We have semi-auto shotguns, why dont they? Issued gear would have been good to evaluate as well, such as armor, but i wont get too picky on the details. The Green Berets simply chose inadequate weapons and didn't even seem to understand the concept of shooting a pistol. The Makarov holster was pretty bad though!

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  44. davecore135 Posted on May 13 '09 at 6:25 AM

  I 100% disagree with this, 1. a shot to the shoulder aint going to kill ya seen it many times in combat, 2. No body armor??? come on now I know atleast the US military uses vest and helmet, 3. how can a knife be more deadly then a E-tool that can cut your friggin head off? Yeah i know the vest and helmet isint for cutting weapons but it will stop a knife from penetrating into your skull or neck or groin of chest or shoulders. And i know good and dang well it will stop all the russian weapons from going into your body it might knock the breath out of you if it hits a certain spot but other then that no. i know the armor i know it works seen it work. The tests come on now this show is starting to get worse and worse. not just saying that because my team lost but i am saying that the stuff isint fair giveing a kill shot to a shoulder but a grazeing shot that prolly hit the liver or kidney because it went through the lower left abdamin

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  45. DoctorJohnJGibbons Posted on May 13 '09 at 6:31 AM

  I like how they made the AK vs M4 contest a tie with the sniper rifle as tiebreaker. Too many religious arguments on the AK vs M16/M4.

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  46. dictatortots Posted on May 13 '09 at 6:43 AM

  why didnt they just give the guys paintball guns and rubber knifes and tell them to duke it out

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  47. naheehs2 Posted on May 13 '09 at 6:48 AM

  I think that Overall they both are equally effective fighters. There are some things I just want to ask:
  
  1) Why didnt the Green berets use a barrett 50.cal, that would have shut the spetsnaz up for good.
  
  2) Why werent the body armor taken into consideration, A 58fps knife shot is nothing, I play paintball and i can see paint flying at me, with 58fps you could put your hand up, arm up or even side stepped out of the way. Either way you stop the knife from killing you.
  
  3) Spetznas used WAYYYY to much flipping and spins. Like i said in Paintball you'd get laughed at after you got lit up, i could only imagine what would happen in Real Combat Situations.
  
  4) The Green Berets are Just more intelligent. Does the Computer register the intelligence of each person? Its easy to have a pain tolerance after getting beaten up for so many months, and its alot easier to show, But what are the tests for a combat situation on a tactical level? Even the beret said " its the mind that is the real weapon" Even the spetsnaz said "its the man not the gun".
  
  5) Are you guys going to make another tier for armor use? It would be logical, to show how effective The weapons would be on the dummies with the body armor donned on them. (Just use the explosives for last :P)

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  48. 3rd_Group_NCO Posted on May 13 '09 at 6:52 AM

  Was this show supposed to be set during the Cold War era or was it a match-up of modern military units? If it is a modern match-up then I have a few comments about the show as well as replies to other postings. First of all, the Green Berets just looked wrong. They definitely don't wear ACUs in battle (unless brass is coming to visit) and the body armor wasn't right. They don't wear ACU body armor at all,and especially don't have the crotch and neck guards. SF body armor is tan and set up differently to allow better mobility. All US systems use the same plates, which will stop a 7.62 round along with soft armor, but the actual carriers are different. I've never seen an SF guy carry an E-tool. Yea, there might be one on the gun truck, but carrying it on kit is ridiculous. It's far to bulky and heavy (not to mention useless in CQC) to tote around on the battle field. As far as weapons go, the Beretta is the standard pistol used, but the CIF teams have their choice of various glocks and 1911s. You can't really compare a 9mm to a .45 damage wise. There have been a lot of comments on the shotgun, but what people aren't realizing is that it is mainly a BREACHING tool. It would rarely be used as a offensive weapon and is only carried on
  door kicking missions.

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  49. 3rd_Group_NCO Posted on May 13 '09 at 6:53 AM

  (cont) As for the sniper rifles, the M24 is extremely accurate with a top notch scope, but SF is currently using the Mk13 300 Winmag which is a much hotter round and even more accurate than the M24 to greater distances. They also have the M107 Barret 50 cal, SR-25, M110, SPR, and M14. Depending on the mission, different sniper systems would be used for different scenarios. The AK-74's stopping power is far superior to the M4. Guys get shot up with 5.56 and keep coming, but a 7.62 round will put you in the dirt. The M4 does have a plethora of optics, though, and can be extremely accurate. SF guys also carry foreign weapons including AK-47s and 74s. Grenades kill (and hurt - I've been fragged twice.) I do agree that the M67 is the way to go. It has more comp b and a larger kill radius. There are other types of explosives carried, but I think the guys at Deadliest Warrior were going for the most commonly carried and used weapons. SF guys train in numerous fighting styles. Some are Army wide, while others are individual or team dependent. Someone mentioned comparing the Spetsnaz to Delta or the Seals, but I think the match-up with SF was legit. SFOD-D is definitely more highly trained with better equipment than regular SF but, as the name implies, Delta IS SF. It stands for Special Forces Operational Detachment Delta and is a specialized SF unit dealing with counter terrorism. You also have the CIF companies in each SF Group that has a Direct Action Mission. As far as the Seals go, they're not in the same boat (pun intended.) Special Forces has numerous mission sets and the Seals are more one-dimensional (except for DEVGRU which is strictly DA counter terrorism.) I hope this cleared some things up. I'm sorry that I got a little long-winded. I think this is a great show and I really enjoy seeing the damage various weapons can inflict. I think it's better suited to battles from ages past, though, because throwing a lot of guns and explosives into the

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  50. nismodave187 Posted on May 13 '09 at 6:53 AM

  they should of used simmunitions in a one on one comparison in shooting positions to pit someone in spetsnaz against a green barret

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