Red Army Infantry vs Viet Cong

January 6, 2011

Finished! Read it all, muahahaha.

This battle is one that pits the old WW2 era Red Army, who fought fascism and won over the Germans with extreme sacrifice. The Viet Cong, guerilla fighters that were unbeatable by American Forces. With Communist influence, they fought hard against the Marines, using inconventional tactics and weaponry.


My initial edge goes to neither side. The Russians fight better in urban situations, the Viet Cong does the best in jungle terrain, where they adapted for combat against American foes, who underestimated them, and lost more in every war. They were forced to pull out when colleges all over the nation erupted in protest.


What the Viet Cong did in defense, the Red Army did in offense. They had gone through a poor phase, where two-men teams would go. One would carry the rifle, one would carry extra ammo. If one died, loot their items and keep fighting. However, once they put on a strong offense against the Nazis, they pushed onwards and won over Berlin.


On to the comparisons!


The Red Army and the Viet Cong both had their impressive display of weaponry. For the Red Army, we have.

Tokarev TT-33

Tokarev SVT-40


F1 Hand Grenade


Short Range:

The Tokarev TT-33 was a sidearm for the Red Army and was later accepted all over the world as a reliable pistol. It was developed by Fedor Tokarev to replace the Nagant M1895 pistol that was in use at the time. Externally, the TT-33 is very similar to John Browning's blowback operated FN Model 1903 automatic pistol, but it also used Browning's short recoil dropping-barrel system from the M1911. However, the TT-33 is not a 1911 clone. It employs a much simpler hammer/sear assembly with an external hammer


Long Range:

While the Mosin-Nagant was a more common rifle among Soviet Forces, the Tokarev SVT-40, or the self-loading rifle (In Russian, called the Samozaryadnaya Vintovka Tokareva) Fedor Tokarev gave up on the self-loading design, and instead, attempted to create a gas operating system. This interested Stalin, a semi-automatic infantry rifle. It ended up being used. The effective range is 550 yards. It fires 7.62x54 mmR cartridges.


Medium Range:

The PPSh is a great sub-machine gun. Although mass produced, the Pistolet-Pulemyot Shpagina was in fact, an effective weapon to stop the Nazi soldiers. It fires 7.62x25 Tokarev rounds, and it can be loaded with either a 35-round box or a 71-round drum. The effective range is 150 meters, which isn't bad considering it's a submachinegun in the WW2 era. There were other SMGs used by the Russians, but this was the preferred one.



The F1 hand grenade, otherwise named the "Limonka" or "Lemon Grenade" was a Soviet grenade. The charge was 60 grams of TNT. The standard fuse is 3.5 to 4 seconds for throwing, or 0 to 13 seconds for booby trap purposes. This had a similar appearance to a pineapple grenade.



The Russian infantry didn't wear armor, but they did wear snow uniforms (Ushankas, coats, etc.) because that's where they normally fought, the snow. However, they could likely adapt if it were necessary.



Their tactics have been reported as different things through history. During the Seige of Stalingrad, they would run right in to machine gun fire, they would rush the opposition until they were dead. But in the Fall of Berlin, the Russians carefully divided their army to hit the Germans from the South, East, and North. They view war as a sacrifice for the better of the Motherland. Men are willing to die if it means  the greater glory for Russia.



The Russian build actually varies, depending on where you're from. The Northerners are sturdy, stocky, and built to last. They can be anywhere in height, from 5'6" to the mid-six feet. This makes them inconsistent in size, but they are still large, and not the kind of person you'd want to mess with. Some were more muscular than others, just like any other nation.


Training (Unmeasured):

As for training, my father (Who was in WW2. He led his own squad.) Never really told me what they did in WW2. I can only assume that it was the same thing as I did. What I did was training around the clock, and the leaders were strict disciplinarians (Yep, that was in the Ground Forces, too.) I do know that being a coward in the Red Army would bring shame for your family, and could even result in your execution.


Also; as an unmeasured factor, more of a factual thing. As in America, teenagers enlisted in the Red Army because they wanted their chance of the action. They wanted to climb the ranks and eventually bring glory to himself. That being said. The Red Army started by everyone being armed. Under the influence of Lenin, people fought in the Civil war, and eventually, represented their country in war. Bolshevik forces fought against the White army, and small Anti-Bolshevik forces after the Government had been collapsed.

It is this sort of fighting that makes you a brotherhood. Your comrades were your family. You fought with your family, to purge the enemy. A lot of men didn't fight for the Government, for the sake of Stalin or Lenin (As de facto leaders) but in fact, most of them fought for their brothers and the Motherland.


On to the Viet Cong!



The Viet Cong were notorious for using Russian weaponry agaisnt the American offense. They used Russian armor, they used Russian guns. It was as simple as that. But they also had more modern weapons that they used. In fact, Soviets did supply the Viet Cong in their quest to spread Communism. This proved rather successful. The Americans claimed many Viet Cong lives, but the war was eventually called off.


Short Range:

For short range, the Viet Cong are going to be using the Stechkin APS Machine Pistol. It's a Russian pistol developed and named after Igor Yakovlevich Stechkin. It was produced from 1951 through 1975, firing 9x18mm Makarov rounds with a blowback action. This carried 20 round clips and fired about 500 to 900 rounds per minute. I have personally fired one of these in a range. And while the buttstock makes it easier to absorb recoil, gripping the gun can prove rather difficult. The effective range is 25m. While it may contend with the Medium Range weapon, the accuracy of this weapon is terrible in comparison, making it less desirable, and more of a last-stand situation.

Medium Range:

I'm changing the Medium Range weapon by request, the AK-47! If you don't know anything about this weapon, go look it up. It's been over-used in the show, and it's a famous weapon, just look up the info.


Long Range:

For Long Range, the Viet Cong use a weapon developed in Nazi Germany, and supplied to them by Soviets who captured it. The Karabiner 98k! Many people still use this rifle today. The effective range is 500m. A five round stripper clip carries powerful 8x57mm rounds. It was the primary service rifle of Nazi Germany.



A thrown grenade the Viet Cong used was the RGD-5! A common grenade used to this day in Russia. The filling weight of the TNT charge is 110 grams, and the fuse is from 3 to 4 seconds. Though not as advanced as more modern grenades which are specifically designed to penetrate CRISAT standard body armor, the RGD-5 is still an effective and very inexpensive weapon. It only weighs about 300 grams, making it incredibly easy to throw.



As with the Red Army, the Viet Cong did not wear any armor, but instead, they usually wore peasant clothing including a wicker hat that could (At least in my opinion) keep their head cool and the sun out of their eyes. They tried to camouflage with the jungle often, in order to surprise the US forces in camps or the ones that were waiting to do something.



The Viet Cong specialized in ambushing tactics. In order to carry these out, they had to live for long periods of time in cave systems, where they held prisoners, went about daily activities, and surprised attackers. Similar to the Red Army, they did not have much tolerance for cowards, traitors, or losing. If you were defeated, they would not take it too kindly. They would execute men who deserved it as a show of force, to keep the rest of the men motivated.

And besides that, they also used massive propaganda to keep citizens and men rallied. This was successful because they were the ones being attacked, and everyone in North Vietnam had a mutual enemy.



The Viet Cong used a different kind of training. They would give soldiers a few bullets a day, and they would hire just about anyone. This limit of bullets taught the Viet Cong how to conserve bullets, and how to actually place shots in vital  places most of this time. They didn't get as MUCH practice, but the practice they got was extremely effective, as proven over time. They were told how to use the weapons the Soviets provided them.

Their understanding of soldiers were as follows, you don't need to be a superior race. You don't need to be the most incredible man ever to join us. Instead, if you join us, and help us with our cause, you will end up being a hero, you will be a good soldier.


Edge time!


Short Range: Tokarev TT-33 vs Stechkin APS Machine Pistol:

With a machine pistol, you're limited. It would be more of an indoor pistol, although definitely effective. This could be considered a SMG in the right hands. The Tokarev TT-33 had a much longer effective range, but a much slower fire rate, even in professional hands.

Edge: Even


Medium Range: PPsh-41 vs AK-47

This one isn't even fair, but the PPSh did have a great range for a submachinegun, the Viet Cong used the AK-47 in a jungle environment, mostly because that was the most common Assault Rifle they recieved. But honestly, they are both great weapons, I have to give it to the one with more BANG!

Edge: AK-47


Long Range: K98 vs SVT-40


Another unfair one, sometimes, the K98 could be used to snipe, but that being said, it's bolt action, and you have 5 shots before you have to reload. Meanwhile, the SVT-40 puts a nice hole in your body while still being fast enough to use in real combat.


Edge: SVT-40


Special: F1 "Limonka" Hand Grenade vs RGD-5


The RGD-5 is a great grenade, no doubt, but in comparison to the F1, and how the Soviets used it, it really isn't a fair comparison. I'm sorry for not going in to details, but if you re-read the pages, it SHOULD speak for itself


Edge; F1


Defense: Heavy Outfit vs No armor/Jungle clothes


I have to say, this one would normally fall in favor of the Heavy Outfit, but this time around, I don't have an edge, both sides are versatile with what they wear.

Edge; Even


Tactics; Soviet vs VC

The Viet Cong were great at using their cave systems, and they were great at doing propaganda, but in reality, this wouldn't mean much if they were out in the open and they had to fight to the death. Now, in training, the VC relied on surprise attacks for the most part, making them the offending party when the US occupiers were busy, this pretty much negates the saving of bullets, if you're raiding a camp, you want people dead, it's as simple as that. Meanwhile, the Russians are a professional military force who are disciplined, and heavy inclined to fight for the glory of the Motherland, to fight with their comrades.


Edge: Soviet Tactics


And now with the comparisons concluded, it's time for the battle. These would all be more detailed if it weren't for how busy I've been, sorry, readers.




A group of five Red Army Infantry sit around a round table, discussing things, they are dressed in Soviet Regalia, and are in unknown territory, all they know is that there are people here with some weapons that they had captured during World War 2. The leader, Captain Dimitri Kondrationok, stood before his men, a PPSh strapped on his back, his Tokarev TT-33, which he had fired in to cowards, in to enemies. He spun it around casually, after having gone over plans with his men, who deliberated on what to do.

"It is simple, we push through the jungle, any oppression will die, and we find a way to contact home, my radio got busted in the crash, so there is nothing I could do to contact back up and get us out of here, the only way this is happening is by fighting."


Truth be told, this particular squad had no idea where they were, they didn't know the people here. Little did they know, they had in fact ended up supplying these people with weapons.


The squad all stood up, and grabbed their respective weapons, ready to fight whoever was there, they kicked open the shack door, and headed out, Dimitri in the lead. Up ahead, something caught the Captain's eye. After moving some brush, he saw some people working, one of them was going in to a cave, the other was setting some stakes down on the ground, probably for assembly, at any rate.

Dimitri approached the man, Tokarev in hand. He spoke his native tongue, which was all he could do. "Gde ya i kto ty?" The man looked puzzled, but did know that he was in fact Russian, he just didn't know the language. The man replied in his own language. "Tôi không hi¿u b¿n, ¿¿ng chí." (No, I do not know Vietnamese, I had to use a translator for that.)

Dimitri sighed, raised his arm to signal his men to get the weapons ready. Dimitri mercilessly planted a bullet in to the man's head, watching him drop on to his own stakes.

This alerted some of the Viet Cong in the area, causing them to emerge from several caves, or, if they were above ground, approach the area. Dimitri put his pistol away, and readied his PPSh. The fight was on. "Razdelit¿! Ivanov, voz¿mite vashi tovarishchi na Zapade, a ostal¿nye iz vas, na menya!" The squad of five split up, Dimitri was with his right hand man, who simply went by his last name, Soledad. He was a mixture of several ancestries, but he proved extremely loyal.


Ivanov didn't know where he was, the trees all looked the same, and the jungle looked quite untamed. He didn't even notice the barrel of a gun sticking through a thicket.


He turned to the sound, and took one shot with his SVT-40, it landed right in to the center mass of the offender, killing him within moments. His comrade, Deskerov, was dead, with a large portion of his head turned in to a rotten slush of gray matter. They proceeded with caution, the Russians only had 4 men, and they had to regroup soon.

Dimitri heard the gunfire, and took Soledad in to some bushes. "Dobrat¿sya do kustov tam, dvigat¿sya!" Soledad nodded, and took a mad sprint to the opposite area, and hid. A Viet Cong tried to get the element of surprise, as he saw the Russian hide. He took out his RGD-5, but didn't know if Soledad was there, still, it was worth it. He pulled the pin and tossed the live grenade in. He smiled wide.

With the loud BOOM! Shrubs and pieces of undergrowth were flung all over the place. The only problem was, he didn't see and blood. From his hill, he peeked down. No Russian corpse? He scratched his head, and fired his AK-47 in to the bushes. Frustrated, he turned around, to see Soledad right in front of him, with a PPSh right to his face. Soledad smirked.


The BRATATATATA was a rather unfriendly sound out in the jungle, coupled with the Faceless Viet Cong rolling down a hill, in to the very same bushes he blew up. "Vrag vnis!" Dimitri gave the thumbs up through his position, and stepped out.


Red Army 4 VC 3


The Viet Cong were a bit worried, some sudden offenders were already in! Ca-Chien Nguyen was the leader of this particular division, tasked with setting up stake traps to prevent any Westerners from exploiting this land's weakness. He and his only two men remained, clustered together in a shack. He took his Stechkin and peeked out, Ivanov and his only man were assumed to be the last of the invaders, and that is who he saw. Using the copious amounts of concealment, he managed to move behind the dumbstruck Russians.


He peppered one mercilessly, and approached Ivanov. Before he could get shot by the Russian Rifle, he kicked it out of his hands, cracking Ivanov on the head with the handle of his machine pistol. This, needless to say, broke his skull, and killed him due to the shredding of the brain. Ca-Chien waved to the rest of his men, who came out. Danh, and Trong Nguyen, who happened to be his brothers.


Red Army 2 VC 3

Soledad moved down the other side of the hill with Dimitri, with caution. Dimitri and Soledad both had their submachineguns ready. They were close to the Vietnamese, he knew it. They both had a single F1. Soledad nodded to Dimitri, and took his out. He saw the only opportunity he had to hopefully take out the Vietnamese. He pulled the pin and tossed the 'nade. "Granata, prigotovit¿sya k smerti!"


The Vietnamese men heard the voices. Ca-Chien took the K98 off of his back, and tossed the Stechkin aside. He was the only one who noticed the grenade. "No!"


He was far enough away to be unscathed, but his brothers were not. Trong was wounded, and Danh was dead. The Russians busted through the bushes, seemingly out of nowhere. Soledad didn't get to shoot fast enough, and was de-brained by the German rifle. Trong was in no condition to shoot, and practically died on his own, only assisted by a few bullets.


Red Army 1 VC 1


It was all down to this, in a panic, Ca-Chien fired again, hitting the PPSh and knocking it out of the Russian's hands, who was, to say the least, displeased. Dimitri did a zig-zagging run, approaching the Vietnamese man, and punching him straight in the chin, The Viet Cong only stumbled, used to this kind of punishment due to his past actions.


He lunged forward, hoping to get a kill on that overconfident man, and in fact, he did connect, after getting all of the wind knocked out of him in another punch, he was still able to tackle the Russian Captain. Ca-Chien raised his fist to strike, and was able to several times, Dimitri smiled as his face was being pummeled. "Spokoi¿noi¿ nochi." He commented, drawing his Tokarev and ramming it against the Viet Cong's head, firing his second round in to the enemy's head.


The corpse of Ca-Chien was rolled off, and Dimitri stood, covered in blood. The little compound they came from was wide open, so he entered, There was a cave entrance, that he spent little time questioning, and went down. It wasn't very deep in the ground, but there WAS a Ham Radio, with a Russian signal already programmed in to it.


Confused, Dimitri investigated further by speaking to it. His voice was immediately recognized, and an evac was planned for him.

Soon after, land forces came through for him, including his General. "Isn't it a little risky to be... Travelling out here, comrade?" Dimitri questioned, upon leaving the shack. The General shook his head, drawing a Tokarev of his own. "No, Kondrationok, these are our allies, we supply... Or, now after what you've done, supplied weapons to them. You have disgraced us." The General lifted his pistol, and shot Dimitri in the head, who dropped in front of the compound, not even knowing his actions.


Winner: Red Army Infantry



This was a razor-thin victory, attributed to the versatile, but time-proven Arsenal of the Red Army, while the Viet Cong had an actual assault rifle, they weren't able to overcome the professional Army.


Red Army Infantry: 507

Tokarev TT-33: 40

PPSh-41: 397

SVT-40: 63

F1 Grenade: 7


Viet Cong: 493

Stechkin APS:53

AK-47: 407

Karabiner 98k: 20

RGD-5: 13


I know you guys are going to think "Oh, he's biased!" But I actually think this win is reasonable given the environment. Sorry, Viet Cong fans.